|
Post by Minnesota Twins on Jan 17, 2023 14:54:22 GMT -6
I know I approached the league with this a few years ago but we couldn't come to a decision on how to do it but what would everyone say if.....
I was able to add 2 owners, and make the league 14 teams, 2 divisions of 7, and the 2 new owners did a full blow build from the ground up? No current owner would have to give anything away. The only negative towards current owners is that the new, expansion owners would be placed at the tip of the 2023 drafts.
Any comments necessary.
|
|
|
Post by Chicago Cubs on Jan 17, 2023 15:13:34 GMT -6
Wow! I can't believe someone wants to do that first off. My biggest concern would be that it sounds like a fun idea in theory. I think in practice it is going to lead to their team being absolutely awful for 3-5 years. What happens if one of them quits in year 2-3 and we're left with a team full of bad players that no other owner wants to take? Any thoughts on what we'd do then. The other negative to me is that I'd feel a little disappointed if I had the number 1 pick in something this year and had to drop down to 3rd. I don't, so that doesn't matter to me. It might matter to whatever team does though. I'd like to hear those owners thoughts on losing the 1st pick.
It does sound exciting to add 2 more dedicated owners though.
|
|
|
Post by New York Yankees on Jan 17, 2023 15:17:30 GMT -6
I've always been pro 12-team. Not a fan of talent dilution that come with 14 teams. Tyler brings up good points as well.
|
|
|
Post by Minnesota Twins on Jan 17, 2023 15:26:19 GMT -6
Wow! I can't believe someone wants to do that first off. My biggest concern would be that it sounds like a fun idea in theory. I think in practice it is going to lead to their team being absolutely awful for 3-5 years. What happens if one of them quits in year 2-3 and we're left with a team full of bad players that no other owner wants to take? Any thoughts on what we'd do then. The other negative to me is that I'd feel a little disappointed if I had the number 1 pick in something this year and had to drop down to 3rd. I don't, so that doesn't matter to me. It might matter to whatever team does though. I'd like to hear those owners thoughts on losing the 1st pick. It does sound exciting to add 2 more dedicated owners though. Idk about awful for 5 years, 2 maybe? But we do give every team plenty of avenues to build. From the FA draft to a team, like an expansion team, having 170 million? The first year or 2, they could easily pick and choose guys they want to go forward with. Not to mention, the talent available in the minors draft this year and probably next? My only real issue is the other part you mentioned. Teams at the top of the board suddenly dropping 2 picks.
|
|
|
Post by Minnesota Twins on Jan 17, 2023 15:31:27 GMT -6
Wow! I can't believe someone wants to do that first off. My biggest concern would be that it sounds like a fun idea in theory. I think in practice it is going to lead to their team being absolutely awful for 3-5 years. What happens if one of them quits in year 2-3 and we're left with a team full of bad players that no other owner wants to take? Any thoughts on what we'd do then. The other negative to me is that I'd feel a little disappointed if I had the number 1 pick in something this year and had to drop down to 3rd. I don't, so that doesn't matter to me. It might matter to whatever team does though. I'd like to hear those owners thoughts on losing the 1st pick. It does sound exciting to add 2 more dedicated owners though. Idk about awful for 5 years, 2 maybe? But we do give every team plenty of avenues to build. From the FA draft to a team, like an expansion team, having 170 million? The first year or 2, they could easily pick and choose guys they want to go forward with. Not to mention, the talent available in the minors draft this year and probably next? My only real issue is the other part you mentioned. Teams at the top of the board suddenly dropping 2 picks. don't. Also, I totally understand the first part. Someone losing interest. That would just be a risk we'd have to take. It honestly came up because I had a guy see a post from the past, and he suggested it. Said he'd love to be one of the expansions teams. Figured I'd humor the idea.
|
|
|
Post by Minnesota Twins on Jan 17, 2023 16:24:13 GMT -6
Here's what I'd propose. For the first part and the draft.
We'd start the draft on time as it was supposed to be. We start at 1, and first pick had the option to either let the expansion teams draft at 1 and 2, or he can make his pick, but at the cost of a draft pick or a prospect. Then we go to 2 and so on. And when we finally have someone say they don't want to pay, that's where the expansion teams draft that round. That goes on for the first 2 rounds.
|
|
|
Post by Minnesota Twins on Jan 17, 2023 17:52:21 GMT -6
Need any and all input, speak now or forever hold your peace...
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 17, 2023 17:58:04 GMT -6
We have a hard enough time not having to replace owners now. Imagine if you add two more that are bad for a few years and not competitive. It would be the equivalent of what Kens team was after he had been in the league for 8 years.
I also agree with the dilution of talent.
|
|
|
Post by Minnesota Twins on Jan 17, 2023 18:02:22 GMT -6
We have a hard enough time not having to replace owners now. Imagine if you add two more that are bad for a few years and not competitive. It would be the equivalent of what Kens team was after he had been in the league for 8 years. I also agree with the dilution of talent. Not to be too defensive but I have to find the owners, and to be honest, I already have 2 guys that want to do it. One that I've known for a hot minute and one that suggested it. So as far as owners go, I'm not concerned with that part. Ken was born during the great depression. He didn't know how to work a cpu. As far as diluted talent goes, while I see what you guys are getting at, I would argue that everyone has the same opportunity to bulk up their prospect roster so they have home grown replacements. As someone who wants competition, I think expanding to 14 would add a whole new level to, not only the field of competition but it adds depth to the minors systems. It adds value to prospects and picks. It's even more incentive not to trade away all your stuff. Or not add that extra draft pick. Everything gains value.
|
|
|
Post by Chicago Cubs on Jan 17, 2023 18:35:00 GMT -6
If they dropped out after a year or 2with a terrible team, would we have to replace them or could we just throw all their players back in FA and go with 13 teams?
I’ll be honest that I’ve often thought about volunteering to take on a crappy team and give mine up. The rebuild is fun for a prospect person, so these guys might be in it for good.
|
|
|
Post by Minnesota Twins on Jan 17, 2023 18:47:30 GMT -6
If they dropped out after a year or 2with a terrible team, would we have to replace them or could we just throw all their players back in FA and go with 13 teams? I’ll be honest that I’ve often thought about volunteering to take on a crappy team and give mine up. The rebuild is fun for a prospect person, so these guys might be in it for good. While I understand the need for peace of mind, at the very least, to have a contingency in place for the 2 expansion owners, I truly believe I have 2 that aren't gonna shit out after 2 or even 4. You have all been here long enough, you've all experienced the league. You see what I do every single day, week, and year. I hear 0 complaints year round. The ones who want a deep deep dynasty league and commit to it? Well, thats you guys. This league is awesome because of all of us. These guys seem to have the same attitude you all do, I'm confident in that.
|
|
|
Post by Minnesota Twins on Jan 18, 2023 9:51:44 GMT -6
I'm gonna leave this up for another 24 hours and then make a decision. If you don't post, I don't wanna hear about it later.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 18, 2023 11:04:57 GMT -6
I have a few thoughts on this proposal. I think I might be the team most affected by this if we did move the 2 expansion teams to the front of the drafts. I would stand to lose the opportunity to draft a top 10 and likely a top 50 prospect, perhaps even 2, since I have 2 1st rd picks in the rookie draft. With the risk of sounding selfish, I would not be happy if we went the expansion route this close to the season. I think I can speak for at least a few of the teams when I say, I have already made my game plan for this upcoming season, I have had discussions about those picks, turned down offers for those picks. Changing the structure of the league now, seems unfair. That said, I do like deeper leagues, and would not be against expansion, and even an expansion draft, but with a reasonable time to adjust plans going into the season.
My 2nd thought goes along with the concern about the new owners longevity. Although I have no question about Taylor's dedication to the league and his ability to recruit owners(we have an amazing group here), I do think the challenge of trying to build a competitive team in this league, without the benefit of an expansion draft is monumental. I say this from a team that has torn my whole team down and am still trying to build a decent team. I had assets to trade, and this process is taking longer than I hoped. These two guys will be coming in with a few prospects and little else to trade with. It could be years before they can put out a decent team. Again, I say this with all the confidence in Taylor's ability to find good owners. Anyways, That is my two cents.
|
|
|
Post by Milwaukee Brewers on Jan 18, 2023 13:44:07 GMT -6
Hey guys, just want to add my two cents into the mix as well.
I'd like to start off by saying that I do in fact support the idea of expansion and truly believe that 14 teams is fairly deep and makes the league fun and places increased emphasis on the other big change from the offseason and that is on prospect collection and development. I would like to believe that many of us in the league like to dream that we are MLB managers and I believe that between the 14 man prospect roster and expansion we get one step closer to a simulation realistic league.
With that though, I would like to pose a few questions and add some food for thought on this process of implementation mere weeks prior to the Minors draft:
1. With the 14 man prospect pool, this was a new one for us all and had the rule changes been implemented in the deadtime prior to November some teams offseason plans may have changed (selfishly, the 14 man roster would have allowed me 1 extra year to make a decision on my young prospect SS's Witt, Oneil Cruz and CJ Abrams) instead of what they had believed they had to do heading into the offseason (i.e. get the rosters legal within the parameters of the league). Yes, I know that we were all able to go back and change decisions, but I had already dealt my prospects by then and it was too late. For the record though, I still probably would have made the deal as my competition window is now.
2. I agree with Bruce to an extent on the Minors draft. We all (whether it's the Minors or Rookie Draft) value the 1st round picks in high regard. In Bruce's case he was the worst team in the league last year and deserves the opportunity as much, if not more than the expansion teams to inject some talent immediately through this draft. Teams with the lowest records from the previous season.
3. Although I do agree that they deserve high picks to get started, I'd like to make a few proposals to be pondered. Proposal: 1. Propose that the top 3 picks of the minors draft get frozen for round #1 only, whereas the teams who finished 10, 11 and 12 still own those and could use them to draft a solid player. 2. Propose that the expansion teams enter the draft at the number 4 position, bumping the rest of us back 2 spots. 3. Propose that they remain in those slots for the remainder of the draft. 4. Propose that post the 2nd compensatory round that each expansion team receives 10 extra picks each (in a snake order) that would allow them to start the league off with 14 players in their minor league system. Just a joke, but I think that would place both of them ahead of Brad's total farm size! Sorry Brad, you use your picks to win leagues and make finals. It's a dig, but one without merit. Rosters
Just quickly going through Free Agency (not considering who may get taken in the draft), there is some talent there for a team to get started both through the draft and FAB. I would venture to say that both owners understand they are taking on expansion teams, both know that they will be gradually building up. Every year in this league stars become available and if the expansion teams manage their salary cap accordingly they can build a solid core within a couple years. Also want to throw out that in research, every single year guys are taken in FAB that blossom into solid players (Emmanual Clase, Spencer Strider, Corbin Burns to name a few)
Questions that I have:
1. If the proposals above do not get adopted or discussed. How would you see the minors draft proceeding? i.e. how would they receive their positions in the draft? Would we lose picks, prospects or anything bringing them in?
2. Where would they in turn slot in for the Free Agent draft? Some teams may have released guys or moved money around saving up for a top high priced Free agent, I almost think it may be late in the game to quash those teams who may have a top 3 pick who've had their eye on someone and maybe not have made trades etc expecting a certain player to be there at that spot and we're only a few weeks away from the draft. Proposal - I would in this case propose that the expansion teams would slot in prior to my pick at #5 to allow those bottom 4 teams the opportunity to continue on with their offseason plans for free agency. I was thinking about proposing the entire group that fell into the consolation bracket, but I figure this may be of a decent consolation.
3. Along with my proposal above regarding extra Minors Picks at the end of the draft, should we consider a proposal to provide them with extra Free agent picks to allow them to maybe form a core of 5-7 players through free agency before having to duke it out with everyone else in FAB?
Look forward to further discussion.
|
|
|
Post by Minnesota Twins on Jan 18, 2023 15:28:12 GMT -6
Hey guys, just want to add my two cents into the mix as well. I'd like to start off by saying that I do in fact support the idea of expansion and truly believe that 14 teams is fairly deep and makes the league fun and places increased emphasis on the other big change from the offseason and that is on prospect collection and development. I would like to believe that many of us in the league like to dream that we are MLB managers and I believe that between the 14 man prospect roster and expansion we get one step closer to a simulation realistic league. With that though, I would like to pose a few questions and add some food for thought on this process of implementation mere weeks prior to the Minors draft: 1. With the 14 man prospect pool, this was a new one for us all and had the rule changes been implemented in the deadtime prior to November some teams offseason plans may have changed (selfishly, the 14 man roster would have allowed me 1 extra year to make a decision on my young prospect SS's Witt, Oneil Cruz and CJ Abrams) instead of what they had believed they had to do heading into the offseason (i.e. get the rosters legal within the parameters of the league). Yes, I know that we were all able to go back and change decisions, but I had already dealt my prospects by then and it was too late. For the record though, I still probably would have made the deal as my competition window is now. 2. I agree with Bruce to an extent on the Minors draft. We all (whether it's the Minors or Rookie Draft) value the 1st round picks in high regard. In Bruce's case he was the worst team in the league last year and deserves the opportunity as much, if not more than the expansion teams to inject some talent immediately through this draft. Teams with the lowest records from the previous season. 3. Although I do agree that they deserve high picks to get started, I'd like to make a few proposals to be pondered. Proposal: 1. Propose that the top 3 picks of the minors draft get frozen for round #1 only, whereas the teams who finished 10, 11 and 12 still own those and could use them to draft a solid player. 2. Propose that the expansion teams enter the draft at the number 4 position, bumping the rest of us back 2 spots. 3. Propose that they remain in those slots for the remainder of the draft. 4. Propose that post the 2nd compensatory round that each expansion team receives 10 extra picks each (in a snake order) that would allow them to start the league off with 14 players in their minor league system. Just a joke, but I think that would place both of them ahead of Brad's total farm size! Sorry Brad, you use your picks to win leagues and make finals. It's a dig, but one without merit. Rosters Just quickly going through Free Agency (not considering who may get taken in the draft), there is some talent there for a team to get started both through the draft and FAB. I would venture to say that both owners understand they are taking on expansion teams, both know that they will be gradually building up. Every year in this league stars become available and if the expansion teams manage their salary cap accordingly they can build a solid core within a couple years. Also want to throw out that in research, every single year guys are taken in FAB that blossom into solid players (Emmanual Clase, Spencer Strider, Corbin Burns to name a few) Questions that I have: 1. If the proposals above do not get adopted or discussed. How would you see the minors draft proceeding? i.e. how would they receive their positions in the draft? Would we lose picks, prospects or anything bringing them in? My proposal for drafts is as follows:
Expansion teams draft at 4 and 5 of the 1st and 2nd round of rookie and minors. Starting in round 3, they draft at 1 and 2. They also receive an extra pick at the end of each round (4 extra picks total in Minors and 7 in the Rookie).
Expansion teams draft at 4 and 5 of the 1st round in the FA draft and top of the 2nd round.
Expansion teams get 1st and 2nd picks in the fa draft in 24 and 25.
Espansion teams will receive 4 fa picks each at the end of the FA draft that they can use if they choose.2. Where would they in turn slot in for the Free Agent draft? Some teams may have released guys or moved money around saving up for a top high priced Free agent, I almost think it may be late in the game to quash those teams who may have a top 3 pick who've had their eye on someone and maybe not have made trades etc expecting a certain player to be there at that spot and we're only a few weeks away from the draft. Proposal - I would in this case propose that the expansion teams would slot in prior to my pick at #5 to allow those bottom 4 teams the opportunity to continue on with their offseason plans for free agency. I was thinking about proposing the entire group that fell into the consolation bracket, but I figure this may be of a decent consolation. see above3. Along with my proposal above regarding extra Minors Picks at the end of the draft, should we consider a proposal to provide them with extra Free agent picks to allow them to maybe form a core of 5-7 players through free agency before having to duke it out with everyone else in FAB? Look forward to further discussion.
|
|
|
Post by Minnesota Twins on Jan 18, 2023 15:38:58 GMT -6
Sorry, to clean it up a bit. This is what I propose. I've already talked to Bruce about it.
My proposal for drafts is as follows:
Expansion teams draft at 4 and 5 of the 1st and 2nd round of rookie and minors. Starting in round 3, they draft at 1 and 2. They also receive an extra pick at the end of each round (4 extra picks total in Minors and 7 in the Rookie).
Expansion teams draft at 4 and 5 of the 1st round in the FA draft and top of the 2nd round.
Expansion teams get 1st and 2nd picks in the fa draft in 24 and 25.
Espansion teams will receive 4 fa picks each at the end of the FA draft that they can use if they choose.
|
|
|
Post by Minnesota Twins on Jan 18, 2023 15:50:58 GMT -6
So lets draw this out.
The 2 expansions teams, this year will get
8 Minors picks each. 14 Rookie picks each. 6 FA picks each.
In 2024 and 2025, they will receive the top 2 picks in the FA draft no matter where they land.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 18, 2023 18:00:38 GMT -6
I'd be worried about FAB also. 2 new teams equal $420 million to use on bidding. Competing Teams will get out bidded generously all season long. I could be thinking to much. But just throwing out some of the Cons that have crossed my mind, and if there is a option to correct before the decided on.
|
|
|
Post by Minnesota Twins on Jan 18, 2023 18:42:25 GMT -6
I'd be worried about FAB also. 2 new teams equal $420 million to use on bidding. Competing Teams will get out bidded generously all season long. I could be thinking to much. But just throwing out some of the Cons that have crossed my mind, and if there is a option to correct before the decided on. After the expansion teams take their 2 FA picks, and possibly 4 more at the end of the draft, I'd think that's gonna dumb down that money. As for the season, sure the expansion teams will be outbidding people. They have to to get better. Everyone's just gonna have to adjust. I'm included. I have like 10 open roster spots. There's at least 3 guys I dropped that i wish I hadn't. But it's all part of a grander scheme to make the league deeper and more competitive. We're all gonna suffer a little bit now, but I feel like it's gonna pay off in a big way later.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 19, 2023 15:13:07 GMT -6
Why is this called crazy proposal? Thanks for letting us in. And when MLB expands to Nashville and Montreal in 4-5 years, we'll have an idea if the league should go to 16 teams, or if it is maxed out.
|
|
|
Post by Minnesota Twins on Jan 19, 2023 15:19:52 GMT -6
Why is this called crazy proposal? Thanks for letting us in. And when MLB expands to Nashville and Montreal in 4-5 years, we'll have an idea if the league should go to 16 teams, or if it is maxed out. Crazy because no one even knew I was looking for a new owner.
|
|