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TB-LAD
May 15, 2023 15:42:45 GMT -6
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Post by Tampa Bay Rays on May 15, 2023 15:42:45 GMT -6
Tampa Bay Gets:
Bo Bichette (TOR-SS) $2.85 Mil Ketel Marte (ARI-2B) $11 Mil
Los Angeles Gets:
Julio Urias (LAD-SP) $14.25 Mil Prospect: O’Neil Cruz (PITT-SS)
I accept. My pitching will now be slowly deteriorating from what it once was. But I really need an offensive spark and Bo is proven he can be that. It will also save me a little money next season not having to pay for urias. Having marte is a good addition to being that jazz will be OF next season and don’t know how many more years Altuve has. So having another 2B can’t hurt. Good deal Elliott! Hopefully it works out for both of us.
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Deleted
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Posts: 0
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TB-LAD
May 15, 2023 16:08:34 GMT -6
Post by Deleted on May 15, 2023 16:08:34 GMT -6
I accept. Pitching is a premium in this league. Urias is A FA but someone I will lock up for sure. And how far off can bichette production and cruz potential really be. I don't like marte personally and the 2nd base spot is awful this year. I gain another open roster spot this year.
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TB-LAD
May 16, 2023 8:53:05 GMT -6
Post by New York Yankees on May 16, 2023 8:53:05 GMT -6
Alright fellas. As the biggest proponent against vetoing trades (any doubt, look up my posts from years past regarding such), I would like to call upon a league-wide vote deciding this trade. If I did not know you guys better from playing with you throughout the years and the professional manner with which you conduct league business, I would be inclined to call this collusion. I am not however, so I will call upon a vote on the terms of a team/league breaking trade.
I have pulled up rankings on a few dynasty sites. Bo Bichette is generally viewed as a top 15 dynasty asset currently batting .324 with 8 home runs and 27 rbis. An ELITE fantasy asset making $2.85 million this year. Julio Urias, generally viewed as a top-40 asset, is coming off two rock-solid seasons, but is off to a pedestrian start this season with a 5-3 record and a 3.61 ERA. The worst part is that he is a rental. If he turns it around this season and returns to "ace" status, his age 27 year will see him making anywhere from $25-35 million roughly. A very expensive franchise tag for a team that will struggle to handle that in the current time. Team breaking.
The Oneil Cruz/Ketel Marte side of things is fine. Marte is playing at a top 10 2B level right now on a team-friendly contract. Oneil is certainly a promising, but relatively unproven prospect.
It is not my intention to poo-poo on anybody's trades or piss anyone off. If the league approves it and I am off base here, so be it. I do not view good pitching at any more of a premium than elite hitting. Just a few observations here worthy of league consideration.
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Post by Chicago Cubs on May 16, 2023 9:06:13 GMT -6
I would like the trade slightly better for Brad in a normal league, but I think pitching is at a premium in this league. I just traded 2 of my top prospects and Max Muncy for 1 year of Clayton Kershaw, so I get where Elliott is coming from.
I may be wrong, so fine with me to vote. I don’t have a problem with it though.
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TB-LAD
May 16, 2023 9:29:20 GMT -6
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Post by Tampa Bay Rays on May 16, 2023 9:29:20 GMT -6
My problem is you said collusion. This isn’t collusion. Yes, Bo is the highest rated player in the deal. But on sites that have dynasty rankings you have Cruz who was ranked in the 30’s pre season and urias a top 10-15 starter. Marte is ranked all the way in the 90’s close to 100 in dynasty. This league is different than most. This isn’t weighed the same as other fantasy leagues. Obviously y’all are gonna do what y’all want to do. But this trade isn’t near as lopsided as it’s being made out. And it certainly isn’t collusion. That would be accusing us of doing something we shouldn’t be. I don’t like the word collision being said. I gave up some good players to get Cruz and now would be giving up my second best pitcher. This isn’t giving up a box of cracker jacks for Bo Bichette. But again. Y’all do what y’all need to do. Just had to get that out.
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Post by Boston Red Sox on May 16, 2023 9:32:32 GMT -6
I am with tyler on this one. I prefer brads side of the trade. But pitching is incredibly hard to come by right now,and urias is a very good one. Oniel cruz could very well become a better asset then bichette, i think we all know what kind of a freak the guy is. I dont believe i see "collusion" here, but i would for sure rather have bichette right now. I also dont think id call urias a rental, because elliot clearly stated he woukd FA him and lock him down.
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Post by New York Yankees on May 16, 2023 9:36:30 GMT -6
My problem is you said collusion. This isn’t collusion. Yes, Bo is the highest rated player in the deal. But on sites that have dynasty rankings you have Cruz who was ranked in the 30’s pre season and urias a top 10-15 starter. Marte is ranked all the way in the 90’s close to 100 in dynasty. This league is different than most. This isn’t weighed the same as other fantasy leagues. Obviously y’all are gonna do what y’all want to do. But this trade isn’t near as lopsided as it’s being made out. And it certainly isn’t collusion. That would be accusing us of doing something we shouldn’t be. I don’t like the word collision being said. I gave up some good players to get Cruz and now would be giving up my second best pitcher. This isn’t giving up a box of cracker jacks for Bo Bichette. But again. Y’all do what y’all need to do. Just had to get that out. Any time a member feels inclined to call upon a league-wide vote for a trade, discussion and differentiation of collusion/team-breaking possibilities is mandatory. Not once did I accuse you of collusion, just that if I didn't know you guys, I would be inclined to think it. Say, for example, two strangers from a public dynasty league made that trade.
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TB-LAD
May 16, 2023 9:46:59 GMT -6
via mobile
Post by Cincinnati Reds on May 16, 2023 9:46:59 GMT -6
I’m at a conference right now for work and haven’t been able to look at this trade in depth. But personally on the surface i think it’s closer than you might think. I really think this will depends on how O’Neil Cruz recovers from his injury. But I also see the point of Urias being a rental but in my mind he is worth tagging.
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Post by Cincinnati Reds on May 16, 2023 9:54:07 GMT -6
I really like the prospectslive rankings and pre-season here are the 4 players rankings: Urias - 55 Cruz - 41
Bichette - 21 Marte - 127
Obviously it changes a bit because of the injury.
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Post by Minnesota Twins on May 16, 2023 9:54:20 GMT -6
This is what I'm gonna say: Brad and Elliot, I don't like the trade. I think on the surface it's not great. But if you dive in to the history, i think its much worse. If either of you would like to speak privately, that's fine. I dont really wanna air this out publicly.
With that said, I support it going to a vote. I'll post a vote thread in suggestions and everyone has 24 hours to vote, excluding Brad and Elliot.
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TB-LAD
May 16, 2023 9:55:16 GMT -6
Post by Minnesota Twins on May 16, 2023 9:55:16 GMT -6
Any other comments can be brought here.
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TB-LAD
May 16, 2023 10:01:09 GMT -6
Post by New York Yankees on May 16, 2023 10:01:09 GMT -6
I really like the prospectslive rankings and pre-season here are the 4 players rankings: Urias - 55 Cruz - 41 Bichette - 21 Marte - 127 Obviously it changes a bit because of the injury. Bichette is the best player and contract in the deal. I would argue by a lot, but I see many disagree. Layer this on top of the burden that a franchise tag on Urias would put on a team like LAD that is strapped for cash. It is a little different for team like yours that has all that cap space.
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Post by Milwaukee Brewers on May 16, 2023 10:04:54 GMT -6
I see both sides here. If this was a Yahoo league sure, maybe a touch lopsided. I agree that Bichette is the best player in the trade. Marte hasn't been worth much of anything and TBH his WAR is probably close to someone who could be had on FAB earlier this year for $0.6. It's still fairly early in the season in which top arms have had 8 starts which means there are about 24 starts left if he remains healthy and we all know he is capable of going on a run and plays for a strong team. Oneil Cruz was a very sought after asset when I owned him and received some very good if not great offers on him that were in my favor at present, but on the long term, maybe not. He could potentially be a 40/30 guy and they're rare. Yes I know his Avg will be shit, but even if he hits .250 that will be a foolish player.
Salary wise:
Marte is ok at $11 (but most certainly I don't think he would be worth it, but lucky for him 2B is as shallow as my personality. Bichette is very team friendly this year at $2.85, but climbs to $11, then $16.5
Urias at $14.25 is great for this year, but Slade is right that he will command a good penny next year and leave Elliott in Financial decision time. Cruz will be under control for like 4 more years, I'd take that as a guy with that much upside.
To summarize, I can easily see Brad dropping Marte if/when he fins a new shiny object to play 2B, Bichette was the catch here, and Urias/Cruz was the price. Marte played the role in getting the deal done and allowing Elliott a miniscule amount of extra cap space for this year, that will get annihilated next year.
Moral of the story, I don't see this as a deal that moves the pendulum far enough to warrant a veto. I've had some offers thrown my way this year that would blow this one out of the water, lmao
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TB-LAD
May 16, 2023 10:07:53 GMT -6
Post by Minnesota Twins on May 16, 2023 10:07:53 GMT -6
I really like the prospectslive rankings and pre-season here are the 4 players rankings: Urias - 55 Cruz - 41 Bichette - 21 Marte - 127 Obviously it changes a bit because of the injury. Bichette is the best player and contract in the deal. I would argue by a lot, but I see many disagree. Layer this on top of the burden that a franchise tag on Urias would put on a team like LAD that is strapped for cash. It is a little different for team like yours that has all that cap space. Piggy backing anything from just a financial standpoint, this trade puts LAD at 80 mil projected for next year, before the Urias franchise Tag. He'll then be left with 8 arb salaries and 6 more open roster spots, for what it's worth.
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TB-LAD
May 16, 2023 10:31:14 GMT -6
via mobile
Post by Cincinnati Reds on May 16, 2023 10:31:14 GMT -6
If Urias isn’t able to be tagged then this trade doesn’t make sense. I agree I would rather have the Bichette side, but personally I still see it being close, but also I’m new to this league and still learning the value of a good contract.
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TB-LAD
May 18, 2023 9:56:14 GMT -6
Post by Minnesota Twins on May 18, 2023 9:56:14 GMT -6
Sheets updated
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